UPS Turns Back on Traditional Marriage and Family


This past summer, Boy Scouts of America announced that they plan to maintain their ban on allowing homosexual Scout leaders.  They cited the principles that the organization has maintained for over 100 years as being the reason for their decision and that official policy states:

“While the B.S.A. does not proactively inquire about the sexual orientation of employees, volunteers or members, we do not grant membership to individuals who are open or avowed homosexuals or who engage in behavior that would become a distraction to the mission of the B.S.A.”

In response to the Boy Scouts’ stand on traditional values, United Parcel Service Inc. (UPS) just announced that they will no longer support the Scouts and will cut all funding from them.  In 2010, they donated $150,000 to the Boy Scouts.  UPS joined with the Intel Corp in pulling their funding from BSA.

The UPS Foundation explains their charitable operations on their Focus On Giving page on their website, which states in part:

“The UPS Foundation seeks to support organizations that are in alignment with our focus areas, guidelines, and non-discrimination policy. UPS and The UPS Foundation do not discriminate against any person or organization with regard to categories protected by applicable law, as well as other categories protected by UPS and The UPS Foundation in our own policies. These include, but are not limited to race, gender, national origin, disability, sexual orientation, gender identity, veteran or military status, pregnancy, age and religion.”

Some are hailing the UPS decision as a brave move standing up for tolerance and diversity.  I believe the Boy Scouts of America are even braver for standing up for traditional moral values and not caving in to a society that is openly embracing perverse lifestyles.  I also believe that by taking this stand against the Boy Scouts that UPS is also turning its back against traditional marriage and family.

When I was in the Boy Scouts many years ago, we were taught sound biblical values of decency and morals.  Most of the core values of scouting were based upon biblical teachings.  I recall one boy who was asked to leave the scouts because of his lack of moral values and decency.  These were things that made Boy Scouts what they are.  To do away with those moral values will only serve to turn the Boy Scouts into a den of predatory homosexual pedophiles salivating over their young prey.

Just ask yourself if you would feel safe sending your son on a campout with a homosexual leader.  If the answer is no, then ask yourself if you want to continue to give your business to UPS?







Posted in Ethics, Family, Homosexuality Tagged with: , , , , ,
  • EdTx

    To be fair, not every openly gay man is a child molester. Let’s get that one clear. There are plenty of straight men who are child molesters. And straight women (inlcuding teachers, as we have come to see in the last few years), for that matter. Does that mean we ban women from being teachers of young men in middle or high school? THAT SAID, what I do object to is a private business trying toi destroy a non-profit enterprise over a disagreement in social issues. MUST WE ALL AGREE to the same things in order to cooperate? I. for one, will now use FedEx for all my shipping needs. So long, UPS.

    • ladyceo

      @EdTx
       We have Obama to thank for all of the divisiveness in the country. He opened Pandora’s box on so many issues! We need to get back to basics and find our moral compass!

    • Ray Downen

      @EdTx Exactly, EdTx. We do well to expect honest and prompt and “good” service from those from whom we buy. We don’t ask company representatives how the company profits are invested. It’s not our business. I marvel that this spokesman for UPS would choose to brag about their ungodliness. I figure it was in order to solicit business from ungodly people, of whom there are many in our nation. But it surely doesn’t seem sensible to alienate godly people unless the company really no longer wants our business!

  • remesquaddie

    O.K….Who do I address my donations to the BSA to?

    • Ray Downen

      @remesquaddie A google search would quickly provide the address. Look for Boy Scouts of America.

  • Contractor Services

    I am closing my account with UPS and will no longer use them to send overnight packages.

  • BobMarshall

    Stop using UPS.

  • remesquaddie

    I rarely ever use UPS. Their service absolutely stinks.

    • Ray Downen

      @remesquaddie I have been served by UPS and always received helpful and prompt service by them. I prefer FedEx because it has been able to keep unions out, but the service I’ve received from both companies has been exemplary. I speak about the people in both companies who have provided service to me. They’re good people!

  • ConscienceCit

    I will and have supported the BS direct.  I also have and will use UPS.  Their decision is a business decision and not an individual, I harbor no ill.  We need to stop all the politically correct BS and if you decide not to support the BS or UPS that is your individual decision and is no one else’s business!

    • chief1937

      @ConscienceCit
       Agreed partially. When UPA decided to make their stand public then it turns to personal preference. Doing as they pleased in silence would be a business decision.Going public says this is my preference and you can like it or lump it .

      • Ray Downen

        @chief1937  @ConscienceCit If any business makes a public declaration of their principles, that should affect every customer. The wise thing is to not make public how company profits are distributed. If a company does do so, as recently Home Depot and UPS have done, then godly people should know they should not do business with those companies.

    • Ray Downen

      @ConscienceCit UPS made it their business to very publicly withdraw support from any organization that doesn’t promote homosexual values. Only those who DO support homosexual values should now do business with UPS.

  • jps4usa

    I am going to inform my UPS driver that wherever possible I will elect to give my business to FedEx until UPS re-instates their contribution to the BSA.  And what’s more I want UPS’s contribution to double.  That would be my demand for favoring the perverse and not good foundational training of the B.S.A. 
    I wasn’t a Boy Scout member, but I was a Little League player and coach and I believe the values instilled by both organizations are sorely needed.

  • jps4usa

    I am going to inform my UPS driver that wherever possible I will elect to give my business to FedEx until UPS re-instates their contribution to the BSA.  And what’s more I want UPS’s contribution to double.  That would be my demand for favoring perversity yet ignoring the foundational teaching of the BSA.
    I wasn’t a Boy Scout member, but I was a Little League player and coach and I believe the values instilled by both organizations are sorely needed.

  • Guest

    I’d be perfectly happy for gay men to be Girl Scout leaders or for lesbians to be Boy Scout leaders. Notice, if you will, that almost all of the incidents of sexual abuse in the Catholic Church are “man on boy,” not “man on female.” No one wants to talk about the homosexuality involved in the majority of sexual abuse cases against children, but it is there for all to see.

    • WeThePeople1

      Yep, your right, the Liberal/Commnust want sex with little children just as Satan does.  And stop beating a dead horse on the Church about abusing children.  Yes it happend, it was less than .01% of the church and you liberal sex freaks try to make it sound like it was 70% of the church, when you got Liberal/Communist raping and murdering little children every day!!!  Get your facts straight before making un-informed comments..!!!  You are most likely another Liberal TROLL, they make me sick!

      • Ray Downen

        @WeThePeople1 It’s surprising that you can speak for everyone, “WeThePeople1.” I wish you had chosen a more honest name. I choose to write using my own name. This is very apt to get ME in trouble. But I prefer honesty. I can’t claim to speak for anyone else. You seem to think you can speak for everyone else.

    • jps4usa

      Neither homosexual men nor women would be acceptable in either organization, in my estimation.

      • chief1937

        @jps4usa
         The Boy Scouts of America have their rules just as the NAACP have theirs. You know what they are before hand if you don’t like them then simply don’t try and join just what gives you the right to demand they change just for you or your group?This post was meant for Guest not jps4usa.

      • Ray Downen

        @jps4usa But it appears that lesbians have taken over the Girl Scout organization, if reports I’ve seen are correct.

    • NunnyahBiz

      The U.S. Bureau of Statistics reports that 78% of all child molestations, child rapes & child murders ARE COMMITTED BY HOMOSEXUALS!!! Tell me where is the logic of being tolerant of child molesters, rapists & murderers???!!! C’mon you liberal c@cksu%k@rs, give me a reason!!!

  • WeThePeople1

    I have spoken with several companies now and they are droping UPS and going with FedX or some the delivery service.  UPS really screwed up this time.  They are going to lose $Billions.  People need to go listen to Dr. Michael Williams show “The Patriot Report” on http://www.webtalkradio.net.  This weeks show will blow your mind and show the people what is really happening in this Country!

  • FormerScout

    Looks like those of us who support the Boy Scouts (and there are millions of us) will need to boycott UPS. Not giving them any more of my money.

    • ladyceo

      I agree!

    • Rick

      Done!

    • NunnyahBiz

      There is no such thing as a “former scout”!

      • NelsonM77

        @NunnyahBiz There are a few gay boy scouts that might beg to differ with you. lol

  • opmayday2012

    Never again will I use UPS for anything!

  • J Joy

    Why is this a business decision???  Even so, when these kinds of things are made public, it makes the division in America wider and Americans have to choose whether to continue using or frequenting these companies.  Companies limit their customer base by making these values and moral decisions public.  So, again I ask, why is this a business decision – it should be a personal decision and not affect a company.

    • Ray Downen

      @J Joy Unlike Chick-Fil-A, whose owner spoke for himself only, this spokesman claims to represent the entire UPS organization, many of whom are Christians and godly people. There is a difference if the person says “UPS will not support” and if he says (with probably no one listening or interested) “I will not support.” This is said to be a company-wide decision by its leaders. Same with Home Depot. And others?

  • J Joy

    It’s just like the celebs who back and promote a political campaign – I tend to not want to see their movies or buy their music or even watch their TV shows.  Their putting their political opinions out there does affect how I look at them.

    • jps4usa

      @J Joy
       My sentiments exactly.  It changes everything.

  • Mdsjules

    This is unreasonable on the part of UPS. Being a scout leader is a thankless job this day and age. It is time consuming, many children do not give their support of time for their own children.
    It’s unreasonable to ask volunteers to keep watch on leaders that could become involved with a child or young man.

  • chief1937

    My answer to your question is NO. I will avoid any possible usage of UPS in the future asd they do not represent my values.

  • SteveT327

    I am disappointed at UPS’s choice to withdraw from supporting the Boy Scouts.  I was a UPS employee for 35 years and love being a part of their culture.  One of the reasons UPS was such a strong company is because of the morals they stood behind.  I am sure their business practices are still as strong as ever, but, we have to remember, that our choices represent our character.  The choice not to support the Boy Scouts for the reason they have given withdraws much needed funds that support the greater growth of young men.

  • George S Saliga

    I am an Eagle Scout and support The BSA all the way. I am also a Christian and love the sinner but not the sin. If this is true about UPS I will no longer use there service, but also for such a large orginazation to only donate $150,000 is also an eye opener. I will also make a donation to my local BSA in direct responce to a just unbeleivable stance by UPS. The BSA has made such a positive impact on so many lives. UPSt don’t have a clue, this just supports the level of disgrace that has befallen Our Country. The BSA has ever right to there position on homosexuality what is wrong with this society have you all lost your minds?

  • jps4usa

    UPS is actually going to lose more than the $150G that it donates to Boy Scouts by customers switching to other companies.  That’s not very smart business-wise.

    • Rick

      @jps4usa I think they’re going the way of JC Penny’s and not soon enough!

  • OldNavyChief

    Time to start shipping with Fedex.

  • Guest

    Time for BSA and ALL of the families of boys who are members, as well as their businesses, to stop shipping goods via UPS. Instead they should switch to FEDEX, telling them WHY they are making the switch, and making sure that FEDEX gets their business only as long as they do not support the Gay agenda as a company.
    The families of Scouts should also indicate to any company with which they do any purchasing that they will NOT accept delivery via UPS, and should that be the seller’s company of choice that they will cancel their purchase and buy elsewhere. And tell them why.
    UPS is not above morality, in fact by making this choice they are, in effect, saying that your boys are all to be considered fair game to homosexuals.
    UPS should be treated like the pariah’s they’ve become.

  • idagney

    I won’t EV ER do business with UPS again. I will also let them know it.

    • Ray Downen

      @idagney I wish you had said, “as long as they oppose godliness” rather than again. The spokesman for UPS may find himself speaking for some other organization soon, with UPS again on God’s side.

  • http://aol.com jean1000

    I’ll be shipping either through the Post Office or Fed Ex AND definitely will send a donation to the B.S.A.

  • http://www.facebook.com/ violettesareblu

    I thought sodomy was a felony.ummmm? wrong?

  • jay

    Yep.  Fed Ex from now on.  Don’t guess these UPS liberals ever took a look at the Catholic Church, where one third of priests are homosexual.   Over 1,000,000 know cases of little boys being molested by these perverts.  Dr Bill Donagh, head of the Catholic League, stated that the Church does not have a pedophile problem, it has a homosexual problem.  The Liberals in the Senate and Obama have placed the sons of our great military at risk.

  • Patriot72

    If UPS insists on upholding the values of and financially supporting faggots lesbians and trannies, I will give my shipping business to Federal Express and insist all packages sent to me and my business use Federal Express.

    • dave a

      @Patriot72 Sign me up. I’m on board with you. Postal service or Fed Ex.

  • davepit1

    I’ll not use ups again!

  • AnnLynn

    I’ve sent my last UPS package ever!

  • minime91746

    Okay, so let’s ship FedX.  We can make a difference if only we will get off our backsides and take a stand.

    • Fed up Lady

      @minime91746
       Count me in.  FedX it is from here on out.

    • CQ

      @minime91746 Ship USPS, Postal Service. Where I live they are very competitive with UPS and FedEx, just as fast.

  • AnnLynn

    I’ve just sent my last UPS package ever!  Those who want a youth organization to include homosexuals should form their own and not try to force compromise on one that’s been around, in the same form as it is today, for a century now. Oh, that’s right, they already have their own organization.

  • iho

    Will all of the companies in the US that are still civilized please stop using UPS.

  • OrlandoLopez

    It’s interesting how people do not understand that having homosexuals in an all male boys only club is too close to the having a male and a female left alone. With this I mean that temptaion will arise to the most vulnerable of all…..your children.  It would just open up a pandoras box. Why would an organization as powerful as UPS think that they can place pressure on BSA by cancelling their support. BSA stood up to UPS but UPS gave into peer pressure. May God continue to bless the BOYS SCOUT OF AMERICA. In my eyes they are more powerful than ups (no caps). Shame on you ups…I own a business that has ups as my account….I am cancelling their account.

    • minime91746

      @OrlandoLopez Great.  UPS giving into pressure is just what the Susan G. Comen did with Planned Parenthood.  Shame on them for have no moral compass.  And then people wonder what is wrong with America.  Really – seems obvious to me.

  • autoxr1

    Don’t just stop using UPS, tell them why!  Send a letter to UPS Chairman and CEO D. Scott Davis and tell him why you refuse to support a company that insists on allowing homosexuals to lead (and spend overnights outings with) young boys as a condition of their corporate support!  Make them understand that this decision will cost them far more than the $150K they were donating to the BSA.  The address is: 
    UPS
    55 Glenlake Parkway N.E.
    Atlanta, Georgia 30328

    • NunnyahBiz

      @autoxr1 Been There, Done that, THEY DON’T CARE!!! They only care about the political correctness of their company’s policy’s, NOT MORAL & ETHICAL VALUES!!!
       
      I hope their MORAL & ETHICAL EMPLOYEES start staging sick-outs during the CHRISTMAS SEASON!!! Along with our boycott, this should be a much more effective message!!!

    • OrlandoLopez

      @autoxr1thanks for sharing this info…I will! & we should all

  • NunnyahBiz

    We’ve said it once, We’ll say it again; Homosexual behavior, be it by a male or female, IS NOT a lifestyle, nor a culture! It is simply BAD BEHAVIOR!!! It must be categorized along with alcoholism, drug addiction and other related dysfunctional behavior! And when these people are ready to admit that they have a problem controlling their behavior, there are many fine institutions that are quite well prepared to help them purge themselves of this bad, perverted behavior! It’s that simple! And until that time, they will be shunned, just as is done with alcoholics & drug addicts! It’s not hateful to shun. Shunning is a gesture of pity, not hate. Just because some “minority groups” condone this “bad behavior” does NOT make it acceptable behavior!!! There is no “hate” involved, as these “minority groups” would have you believe, it’s just WRONG behavior! The “MAJORITY” has spoken on this issue several times, there is no longer any reason for further debate! If you don’t like the way We do things in this Nation, you are welcome to leave anytime, but you will NOT overthrow the “Will of the Majority”!!! Case Closed!

  • NunnyahBiz

    We’ve said it once, We’ll say it again; Homosexual behavior, be it by a male or female, IS NOT a lifestyle, nor a culture! It is simply BAD BEHAVIOR!!! It must be categorized along with alcoholism, drug addiction, pedophilia and other related dysfunctional behavior! And when these people are ready to admit that they have a problem controlling their behavior, there are many fine institutions that are quite well prepared to help them purge themselves of this bad, perverted behavior! It’s that simple! And until that time, they will be shunned, just as is done with alcoholics & drug addicts! It’s not hateful to shun. Shunning is a gesture of pity, not hate. Just because some “minority groups” condone this “bad behavior” does NOT make it acceptable behavior!!! There is no “hate” involved, as these “minority groups” would have you believe, it’s just WRONG behavior! The “MAJORITY” has spoken on this issue several times, there is no longer any reason for further debate! If you don’t like the way We do things in this Nation, you are welcome to leave anytime, but you will NOT overthrow the “Will of the Majority”!!! Case Closed!

    • Ray Downen

      @NunnyahBiz You speak as if you could control others’ behavior. You can’t. Nor can you make additional laws, as you seem to suppose you can do. We all need to be humble as well as seeking to be right. And can any of us be sure of what “the majority” thinks? None of Your Business speaks loudly and as if he or she knew all about how everyone thinks and will act. The subject of sex is one which is very personal for each of us. It behooves us to not tell anyone else how they can think. We should seek to have our legislators make laws about how people can act responsibly, but it’s not sensible to suppose we can do it alone! The Scouts do well to want only heterosexual leaders in each scout troop. But some slip past them and damage troops despite the best controls that can be made on paper. Just now, it matters greatly how we should go about nullifying the bad things Obama wants to do to us. I think politicians in each state should be urged to act to keep their state free from the worst things in Obamacare and the other bad things to come from the Obama White House. And we should thank God that the House is no longer led by Pelosi!

  • 2chestnuts

    I have sent this to all on my email list and have asked them to NOT use UPS during the holiday season and thereafter if possible.
     
    They (UPS Corporate Leaders) have no regard for our youth.  They must be held accountable to society and the safety of young Americans.
     
    We really can do quite well without UPS.

    • Fed up Lady

      @2chestnuts
       You said it perfectly.  Thank you 2chestnuts.

  • Fed up Lady

    So, UPS is now DISCRIMINATING AGAINST THE BOY SCOUTS ASSOCIATION, because of POLICIES that have been in existance for over 100 years. 
     
    I say BOYCOTT UPS.  Once they start feeling the pinch FINANCIALLY, BOYCOTT them some more. 
     
    Companies like UPS are a disgrace to the USA.

  • GeoTom

    The UPS Foundation used to support the Boy Scouts because they believed in the Boy Scout program and it looked good to their customer base to support such an outstanding organization. The Boy Scouts are a character-building organization for boys and young men.  Since 1910 the Boy Scouts have not wavered, using the Scout Oath, Promise, Laws and Motto as their Business Model.  On the other-hand, the UPS Foundation has shifted its policy to conform to fashionable viewpoints that appeal to a broader base of consumers.  So, it comes as no surprise that it’s ALL ABOUT MONEY and not character for UPS.  The Boy Scouts would be a lot better off without such spineless benefactors like UPS, one that appears to be willing to compromise on important values that undergird the Scouting program.

  • minime91746

    It’s not that they don’t want our business, they think we won’t stop using their services.  They think this because we have a history of not standing up for our moral principals.  Look where that has gotten us.

    • Ray Downen

      @minime91746 It’s not that we can be sure WHY the company announced a decision to no longer support the Scouts. We cannot see the hearts of the executives who made that decision. It may be tied in with the fact the company has to work with a union which is opposed to what is good. FedEx has managed to keep union goons away, which is much better for all concerned. But if a spokesman for management at UPS states they will no longer be on the side of good and God, then people who are morally straight will choose to take their business elsewhere. I am guessing that the announcement was intended to steer more business TO UPS from strange-thinking people that some refer to as “gay.” It will be good if their profits disappear following the announcement.

      • minime91746

        @Ray Downen No we can’t know WHY, but regardless of the reasons, I don’t want to support any group that refuses to support a good outfit like Boy Scouts.  Why do we continue to make so many important decisions based on the LGBT agenda?  just saying…………………

  • PatriotArt

    Cold day in hell that I’ll ever use UPS again – even if it costs twice as much more to use it’s competitors.
     
    What a crap-sandwich to serve up the Boy Scouts – hope they fold under this slap in the face to one of America’s most revered institutions!

  • BarbPatton

    ups what are you thinking?? you fools—- I hope there are enough people to decide to no longer support your business

  • Admiral America

    Everyone thinks it’s so trendy to support the queers but realistically I don’t think that many people really care for their weirdness.  It’s just a small minority of the liberal entertainment industry along with liberal media support that hype these nuts.

  • Dodie1990

    UPS is entitled to support nyone or not support. The religious folks got all excited when the head of Ckik-fil-a bashed gays. That was okay but UPS can’t offer an opinion.

    • Ray Downen

      @Dodie1990 Tilt! The owner of Chick-Fil-A was asked his opinion. He gave it and bashed no one. A spokesman for UPS as a business made it a point to announce that they would AS  A BUSINESS no longer support the Boy Scouts of America because they endorsed homosexual practice and the BSA knew they didn’t want their leaders to be queer men. The one gave a personal opinion. The other spoke for a business. Many went to Chick-Fil-A to show support for the owner’s opinion which is that normal sex is normal and abnormal sex is abnormal. It appears that a few or many may quit shipping by UPS because they disapprove of the public announcement by UPS that they favor funny sex. Of course UPS can offer an opinion. The funny folks asked them to do so and they did it!

      • minime91746

        @Ray Downen  @Dodie1990 People supported Chick-Fil-A because of the bashing Mr. Cathy took in the “media”.  And, good for those of us who supported him and his business.  Rahm Emmanuel of Chicago said Chick-Fil-A wasn’t welcome in his town.  I bet Rahm support UPS.  Sad state of affairs our country is in.

    • jps4usa

      @Dodie1990
       The CEO of Chick-fil-A did not bash gays.  He simply stated that he and his family believe in marriage as one-man, one woman.  His company serves all sorts of people regardless of their sexual preference.  There was no condemnation at all in his statements. Now UPS is free to not only offer its opinion but apply it to its business policiies, but customers reserve the right to buy or not to buy its products or services.

    • sscannell05

      @Dodie1990 He never bashed gays. Gays bashed him with threats and violence because of his beliefs. So, what you’re saying is he has no rights and you can say and do as you like. Typical hate group rhetoric.

      • NelsonM77

        @sscannell05  @Dodie1990 Dan Cathy doesn’t speak publicly about hating homosexuals. He just puts his money where his faith is and supports hate groups that support deadly agendas around the world. Yeah, he has a right to say whatever he wants, and we all have a right to call him a bigoted buffoon for it too.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  My, you are afraid of things you don’t like. Cathy supports “hate groups that support deadly agendas around the world”? Nonsense. He just doesn’t approve of homosexual “rights” which are no rights at all. The groups he says he supports simply seek to please God and do what is right.

  • jww

    Request Federx and NOT UPS

  • jimmydg

    I’ll ask for Fedex next time!

  • Arizonasicandtired

    My company has sent its last parcel by UPS. we will refuse any sent by them too.

  • SchreckenLicht

    Doesn’t matter much to me anyway as I use (and will continue to use) FedEx almost all of the because they are cheaper.  Even Ebay is going to give sellers the option of shipping by FedEx instead of UPS.

  • JimSchafer

    if the UPS is a part of the postal system, are they not required to deliver the parcels of postage? this is a part of the postal pledge toward the general population, as i understand it to be–please correct me if i am wrong?( but please do so only with objective data).

    • AnnLynn

      @JimSchafer UPS (United Parcel Service) is a private industry and not part of the USPS (United States Postal Service).

    • minime91746

      @JimSchafer UPS is United Parcel Service.  USPS is the United States Postal Service.  They are not connected in any way.

  • JimSchafer

    oops! i messed up; please forgive my previous statement

  • JimSchafer

    my future mailng services i am going to use is anything but the one that made the big oops(the UPS)

  • PhillipLake

    People, Stop, think and remember. We have been told, time and time again, that all of these lifestyles were coming. How many ways do God and Jesus have to say it. We will have to live with divers of pervasive lifestyles, BUT we do not have to accept it in our personal lives. Do not be afraid to voice your opinion. Do not be afraid, and foolish like they are. Do not fail to teach your children the truth. God did not say that we have to starve to death or go naked. If we refuse to live with these around us, then what good are we to Jesus. We might as well hide in the corner. LET THEM KNOW HOW U STAND, but do not play in the same mud hole. You might be a Christian but think that having a smoke or a drink occassionaly is okay, but I can’t stand either one. If every brewery, distillery, winery, and tobacco plant  was to burn down tonight I would not shed one tear. I would praise God, but I would not refuse to stand beside you because I used to smoke and drink myself until God, Jesus and other Christians helped me to give it up. I have got a WHOLE LOT of things wrong with me but I sure am glad that I have good people around to keep me straight. Something about a “candle” and a “basket…

  • travis41

    I am veeery glad that my current order from Total Vac.com is coming by FedEx,I was unaware of ups dumping the BSA,I consider my years as a Scout, some of the best of my life.Evidently Total Vac { a family run business} was aware of this.By the way we also have the option of having parcels delivered by the USPS,& they r generally at least $ I cheaper per delivery.

  • NelsonM77

    Bravo to UPS for standing up for equality. Someone might like to tell Dave Jolly to relax, UPS hasn’t banned it’s employees, or the BSA from allowing heterosexuals into their ranks. Traditional values are still allowed, and so are a few new ones.Being able to adapt and overcome was a core tenet of my Army training. Understanding the world around me and finding ways to excel in it became second nature. I refuse to ignore evidence that doesn’t support my world view. I decided that it must be my worldview that must change with the new evidence. Since I learned to think critically about the world around me, there are no boundaries, no arbitrary brick walls to repeatedly beat my head into. I use logic and reason to guide my life and the Bible has a new home in my library, in the fiction section, next to other myths like Islam, Hinduism, The Story of Zeus, and Jack and the Beanstalk. Start reading other books and you will learn that the gay guy down the street, doesn’t pose a threat at all. The biggest threat to you and your families, is believing in that book on your nightstand.

    • minime91746

      @NelsonM77 My dear, this is not equality.  This is pandering.  For what reason, I can’t begin to know.  However, I will take God’s word for the perversion of the same sex physical act.  This is not all about LGTB having it their way, it is about morality.  I will keep the book on my nightstand and continue to believe in the Word.  You may think it is a threat, and that is your opinion.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but not to their OWN truth.  The truth is the truth – simple as that.

      • NelsonM77

        @minime91746 Morality is subjective, meaning that it changes from one person to the next. The morality of the god of the Bible cannot begin to stand up to the morality of most human beings today. It is far inferior. By today’s standards, no sane man or woman would support the killing of their own children for disobedience. No sane person would demand infants to be killed by a sword, as the god of the Bible is purported to have done. The morals of that book do not hold a candle to my morals. I find it disgusting that people defend the barbarism depicted within. If that is you moral compass, your morals are sorely lacking.

        • sscannell05

          @NelsonM77  @minime91746 NM77 you really know nothing about the Bible. God never had children killed with a sword. He was testing two people who claimed to be the father of the child. Through this he devined the child’s true father; the one who would have given the child up rather than see the child hurt. If, you insist to use the Bible for your arguments at least know know half as much as the Devil. He uses it the same way you do.

        • NelsonM77

          @sscannell05@minime91746 You really should read your Bible instead of just use it to wave in front of people.Samuel 15:1-3
          15:1 Samuel also said unto Saul, The LORD sent me to anoint thee to be king over his people, over Israel: now therefore hearken thou unto the voice of the words of the LORD. 
          15:2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt. 
          15:3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass. And then in Samuel 15:815:8 And he took Agag the king of the Amalekites alive, and utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword. You have no idea what I l know about the Bible. I study it constantly because people like you do not. I want to know what is inside. I began this study to strengthen my faith and soon discovered the wickedness of the god described within. Perhaps you would like to know more about the Bible. I suggest you read it.

        • Rick

          @NelsonM77  @minime91746 Some morals there guy. Sad, very sad indeed.

        • Rick

          @sscannell05  @NelsonM77  @minime91746 Ditto!!!
          Prepare for the onslaught. They have put out the word and now they are flooding this board with their nonsense..

        • sscannell05

          @NelsonM77 Then you should know that Samuel was the Old Testament and The Hebrew Bible. They broke the Covenant with God an lost Grace. That said; the Bible written by men who as today use it to control and fool the people for the Devil will always be in question. I myself believe in the God of Jesus, fair and just.

        • NelsonM77

          @sscannell05 Mathew 10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  Nelson knows a little, perhaps much too little to be writing to adults. The Old Testament is the record of God’s dealing with a tribe of people whose destiny was to be host to God’s unique Son who was sent to provide life to all mankind. God chose to set aside a land for His people, a land they had to fight to conquer and take over from people who were already living there. That was long ago. When Jesus came, He taught something vastly different from what you suggest is God’s will for His people on earth. There is no longer a “holy land.” No place on earth is set aside for the use of God’s people. Bible students know this, so they don’t pretend that instructions for the tribes of Israel about conquering territory have anything to do with the instructions given to God’s people today. 
           
          You want to know what is in the Bible so you can debate with us who love God and His Word. If you read it to learn about Jesus of Nazareth you might learn how to have eternal life. But you’re looking for things to oppose God’s people rather than to gain life for yourself. WE who love Jesus are not still trying to drive ungodly people out of a holy land. That has nothing to do with the Way of Jesus Christ. You think God is wicked. I know God is love. But I studied the Bible even while knowing that what the Jews were told long ago they were to do had nothing to do with what God’s people today are to do, and you seem to be unaware of the New Testament where the Way is spelled out and sinners are invited to turn to Jesus for life. You misunderstanding can be understood, but it gives no credit to you that you imagine we are still living under the Old Covenant.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen My knowledge of the Bible is not absolute, of course. Many people know much more than me, to be sure. You say I have to read the Bible a certain way in order to “gain life”. So basically you are saying that only a person willing to accept the Bible as true, can gain anything from it. What you are really saying is that, to gain a level of delusion sufficient enough to satisfy the human psychological fear of death, one must read the Bible as if it were true. You ask that people accept what it says without critically analyzing any part of it. I find what I do in the Bible not because I’m out to destroy religion, but because it is in there and I choose to see. My Bible study began long before I became an atheist.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  God told His people they needed to cleanse the land to which He had led them. God knows what is best. Wicked people will not mix with God’s people in Heaven as they do here on earth. But God has not given a particular part of the world to Christians. We are told to win others by telling them about God’s love and never by force. So for Nelson to go to the Old Testament writings to understand God is to mislead himself and those who believe his writings. Nelson is headed for eternal Hell. By his own choice. But God, through His Son Jesus, invites all to head instead for eternal life. God is stern, that’s true. Those who hate God will be sorry. But all living people are invited to turn to Jesus and gain eternal life. God is not wicked in any way.

        • Ray Downen

          @sscannell05  It’s not clear who “they” are. But the nonsense I see is from the pen of Nelson and now Rick.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 What I’m saying about reading the Bible is that it includes the words even of the Devil, so it’s a mistake to believe every word in the Bible. And you have chosen to read parts of the history that have nothing to do with you or with any search for Bible truth. If a person wants to know truth about God, the search surely should not start with the Old Testament unless the searcher is a Jew and has a desire to see how God taught Jews. From what you write, Nelson, I judge that you started and stopped with the Old Testament, having made up your mind to hate God long before Jesus came on the scene. If you had begun by reading the gospel accounts of the life of Jesus, you would have learned of the LOVE of God. It’s not too late for you to study the writings of apostles of Jesus if you have any desire to know the truth about our Creator God. Boy Scouts are encouraged to read the Bible. If they start with the Old Testament they also may get a wrong idea about God, who dealt with primitive people in primitive ways.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen  @sscannell05 LOL, I thought Rick was on your side.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen The very simple and obvious fact is, that all of the things you attribute to a god, are simply things that the Bible says god did or said. In the end, you have to either accept it as true, or require evidence. This is a very simple thing. I have chosen to require evidence, and you have chosen to accept it as true.

      • Ray Downen

        @minime91746  How right you are! And the truth is that BOY scouts are boys and not girls. The organization is prejudiced, without doubt. They do not offer membership to girls. Nor do they want the boys to be led by women. And they do well to call for the leaders to be family men whose example is good for the boys who will be men.

    • http://www.livefyre.com/ Just Jill

      @NelsonM77
       I have marked your name on my prayer list as my total belief in God commands me to pray for the unbelievers. I have so much sympathy for people like you when the Lord settles His judgment on everyone. Homosexuality is an abomination in the eyes of God, but the biggest sinner of all is the non-believer. I pray each night that our land be healed and that the Lord will shine his light into the hearts of people like you. You may not believe in God, sir, but God believes in you.

    • Rick

      @NelsonM77 Why do you equate normal peoples repugnance to the life style and behavior of the homosexual community with “posing a threat”. It’s just not nor has it ever been embraced as normal human behavior by society. I don’t see it as a threat but It does impose on my religious and social beliefs. Guess who is in the majority opinion here?

      • NelsonM77

        You feel that way because you were taught to feel that way. The same reason you believe in a god.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 Anyone who knows much about life on earth cannot doubt that there is a Creator. Intricate life and intricate interaction of planets did not just happen to happen. There had to be a Creator. So of course we believe in God. And of course we are sorry for anyone who imagines that this earth just happened to happen for no purpose and with no end.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen That we find ourselves in a Universe that is uniquely suitable for our existence is no big surprise. Had there not been such a place, we would not be there to ponder the idea. This does not automatically mean that we are the purpose for everything. That is an absurd assumption based on nothing more than ego. To assert that a creator must have designed everything in order to allow us to exist, is beyond vain.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 I’m amazed that anyone can be so uninformed and think themselves so well informed. It does seem strange that God could love us humans and care whether we live or die, whether we’re happy or not, whether we’re healthy or sick. Yet He does love us each one and invites us to prepare here for an eternity of happy fellowship with Him in Heaven. It would be very unwise for anyone to reject His invitation.

  • sscannell05

    The day Gay couples procreate without the help of doctor’s or surrogates will be the day I believe GOD has given his blessing to it. Until then it is as unnatural as cows with sheep or cats with dogs. Next thing we will see is someone wanting to marry their pet pig and screaming special rights for Beastieality. Immorality at its best and they wonder why the world is a shamble.

    • NelsonM77

      @sscannell05 I don’t suppose it has crossed your mind that there is a distinct difference in someone taking sexual advantage of an animal and two sentient beings agreeing to co-habitate together. First you would have to recognize that homosexual couples do more together than have gay sex. They also share their lives just as heterosexual couples do. The same things I would do with a girlfriend, they do also. Like going to the movies, the park, the beach, or traveling to distant places.  I’ll need some evidence in support of a god for me to consider that hypothesis. Indeed, I imagine that if one were to cause gay men to become pregnant, or lesbian couples to conceive without artificial insemination I may be inclined to entertain the idea of a deity. However, I would need additional supporting evidence to supplement the circumstantial evidence. Do you have any?

      • sscannell05

        @NelsonM77 Well, if this is your argument. A person with this type of immorality would say; “I go on long walks with my pig and it listens. We never argue. It lays in my lap and watches movies with me sometimes falling asleep. Unnatural is and always will be unnatural. Two people of the same sex can not procreate because of this and to me that’s proof enough for now. Like I said when procreation between same sex happens I’ll agree that it’s natural; but, I’m not going to hold my breath for that to happen.

        • NelsonM77

          @sscannell05 So you think that the only reason for two people to enter into a loving relationship, is to procreate, right? Should infertile people be prohibited from getting married? Also, pigs cannot say yes. In fact, pigs cannot say anything at all. Contrary to biblical belief, no animals can carry on a conversation with humans, not even snakes. Without this basic communication, entering into a intimate relationship is impossible. Communication is the keystone to any relationship.

      • minime91746

        @NelsonM77  @sscannell05 Nelson, for those who need an explanation of the procreation of the human species nothing will do.  You want what you want and no matter how it effects society as a whole, you still want what you want.  Selfish, selfish.

        • NelsonM77

          @minime91746  @sscannell05 Please, tell me how allowing homosexuals to participate in society AS EQUALS with the rest of us, is going to affect society. My relationships with women have not in any way been affected because some guy I have never met is allowed to marry the guy of his dreams. IT DOESN’T AFFECT ME or ANYONE ELSE. The same arguments were given by similar groups to try and prevent giving interracial couples the right to marry. It’s sad.

        • Rick

          @minime91746  @NelsonM77  @sscannell05 Is’t selfishness what they are all about and not just being tolerated by society for which they should be grateful.?

        • NelsonM77

          @minime91746  @sscannell05 Is it selfish for you to want to be allowed to contribute to society and participate in it? Would it be selfish to demand basic human rights? Think about it for a minute and really ask yourself if it would be selfish for you to demand to be recognized in your relationship with your wife (assuming you’re married)?

        • Rick

          @minime91746  @NelsonM77  @sscannell05 Boy do you have that right!
           
          What’s to be proud of  anyway? There is no prize for winning natures mistakes now is  there?

        • Rick

          @NelsonM77  @minime91746  @sscannell05 That is getting to be a real old  argument that simply doesn’t hold water.
           
          It effect’s society and the glue that binds it.

        • NelsonM77

          @minime91746  @sscannell05 Au contraire, it is nature’s mistakes that become evolution’s triumphs. Without biological variation evolution could not occur and we would not be here at all. By the way, humans are not the end product. We are still evolving. There is no end product, just the next big thing. We are simply another link in a long chain of ever changing biological reactions to stimuli.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  Godless people assume that evolution is true. There is not one bit of proof that evolution has ever occurred other than the natural changes within species which are affected by natural changes in environment.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen There are vast mountains of evidence in support for the theory of evolution. Let me repeat that, VAST MOUNTAINS of EVIDENCE are available for anyone willing to open their eyes. You can deny it all you want, but that will not change the reality of the situation.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 I assert that there is not one speck of evidence that any species has ever evolved into another species, which is what the theory of evolution states. Rather than a mountain of evidence FOR evolution, there is a total absence of any proof of such a thing. My eyes are open. I see species changing through the years depending on many factors which can affect life. But not one shred of evidence that any species every becomes a different species. Or ever has done so. Humans were not once apes. Fish have always been fish. Butterflies have always been butterflies. Buffalo have always been buffalo. Horses have always been horses, never cows. There’s no evidence even that wolves were once dogs. Evolution is a theory. It lacks any supporting evidence.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen Ray, I’m going to try and explain a few things that you seem to be in a state of misunderstanding about. You do not have a working understanding of the Theory of Evolution or the definition of the word “theory”, as it pertains to science, So we’ll start with the word “theory”. A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world, based on a body of facts that have been repeatedly confirmed through observation and experiment. What I believe you are confusing this with is a hypothesis. A hypothesis is a proposed explanation that has yet to be tested. In other words, a guess based on observation. Now, on to evolution. Horses have never been cows. That is quite astute of you. However, humans are apes right up to this day. We are not monkeys, though. We do share some common ancestors though. You see, modern humans and modern monkeys, both evolved from an ancient ape. And no, this ancient ancestor didn’t just pop out a human and a monkey one day. It was small changes that slowly changed individuals until speciation occurred. DNA research has uncovered proof of this. The DNA of humans and chimpanzees is so close it is ridiculous. We even know the exact chromosome in humans that is a fusion of two ancestral chromosomes in chimpanzees.We inherited these chromosomes from a common ancestor. The domestication of dogs from wolves is a well documented fact. Archaeology and biology both support this. We have found transitional fossils showing how many animals developed from ever so slight changes over long periods of time. If you are looking for some animal to morph into another, you are simply confused about the entire conversation we are having.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 I repeat that there is not one iota of proof of any species ever “evolving” into a different species. The claim is made. The proof is lacking. To say that since the DNA of a human is similar to the DNA of a monkey proves evolution is to speak ignorantly. To claim that a theory is an already-proven fact is to misunderstand language. A theory is a guess about what MIGHT be true. If it were proven it would no longer be a theory but a fact.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen You can repeat your inaccurate statements until you are either blue in the face or dead, but it will not change the facts. Facts by the way are not as important in science as theories. You see, facts are just simple data. Theories are an explanation of the data. You are making my point better than I could ever hope to because in every post your highlight the scientific illiteracy that is crippling the minds of millions of people. You have no idea what a scientific theory is. You have no idea what evolution means. That in and of itself is not the worst thing in the world. It at least leaves room for improvement, but you also refuse to accept any evidence that opposes your worldview and that is a travesty. Your mind appears completely shut off to reality in favor of a blissful ignorance. So Sad.

      • Rick

        @NelsonM77  @sscannell05 How touching and endearing, (NOT!)
        They can do what ever they want behind closed doors. I just don’t want to hear the constant whining and the in-your-face attitude and behavior. I have long held the position of live and let live until the homosexual community chose to embark on their current path.
         
        Now I actively support and contribute to those organizations who have enough moral fortitude to stand up and fight this nonsense,. Back under your rock folks!

        • NelsonM77

          @sscannell05 What exactly do you think homosexuals are fighting for? Do you suppose they want gay sex in the streets? Or forced sodomy in public schools? Perhaps they are advocating for Wacky Wednesdays where hump-day takes on a whole new meaning. Of course, the LBGT community isn’t fighting for any of this. They simply want to be allowed to live in our society as equals. They want to be equally allowed to work in any profession. They want to be equally allowed to share their lives with their loved ones. They want to be equally allowed to visit their loved ones in the hospital. They want to be equally allowed to leave their belongings to their loved ones after death. They want to be equally allowed to form a family and be loved within it. They should be allowed to be equal in ALL of these things. To deny anyone basic human rights strips us all of our humanity.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  They want to pretend to be a family when they are in fact not a family. Society asks that they just keep their oddness to themselves and not advertise it. A family is a father and mother and their children if God blesses the union with children. Two males can be partners and friends. They can’t be a family. Same with two women. Impossible that they can form a family. They can merge their incomes, they can share a residence, but they cannot be a family even if laws are changed to pretend that they are a family.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen I pity you the more I learn of you. I’m sorry your experience with family has been so narrow and confined.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 I was blessed to have a father who loved me and helped me grow to be a man. I was blessed to have a mother who loved me and helped me grow to be a man. I was blessed to have a sister who married a good man and had three children who now have children of their own. I wish I had had a larger family. That would have been fine. But my experience “with family” has not been “narrow and confined.” Thanks for your concern.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen Family can extend to anyone you choose. The fact that you choose to define it so narrowly leads me to think that you have never even considered the prospect that FAMILY could be anything more than the people you happen to be related to by blood. You are thinking inside the box. You believe that A + B = C and no one should question it. You seek rigid definitive answers in a world that is ever changing. I understand the allure of solid, firm, and unchanging certainty, but that is not reality.

    • minime91746

      @sscannell05 Amen

    • Rick

      @sscannell05 It’s called the “Slippery Slope”!

  • justis 1

    I cannot understand why some people have a hard time understanding the definition of “pedophile”.  If they don’t know, they need to check a dictionary.  Why would the BSA allow them to be in a position of leadership?  That would be the same as allowing a rapist to be a leader in the Girl Scouts of America.  Would UPS also object to that organization not allowing these perverts to be alone with their children?  I urge everyone to boycott UPS and use Fed Ex.  Tell the CEO of UPS that they are wrong and will pay for their defense of children being offered to perverts. Right is right and wrong is wrong, UPS needs to be shown the difference.  Lose of revenue makes a good hammer.

    • NelsonM77

      You lack of understanding possibly stems from your misunderstanding of what a homosexual is. You may first want to educate yourself in this basic way and then attempt the chore of thought again. Gay men are not out to rape boys. By your logic, no man should be allowed to be in a position of authority over any girl.

      • justis 1

        @NelsonM77 you need to reread my posting.  I never said homosexuals are out to rape young boys.  That was your statement.  By the way, are there documented cases where homosexuals have in fact raped young boys?  As far as the GSA is concerned, unlike you, in your statement, I do in fact not believe that a rapist should be in a position of authority over any girls.  This situation has been documented hundreds of times over the years.  Do you also defend pedophiles being in charge of young children (also documented thousands of times).  You should not take this personally.  There is no attempt to include you in these instances that were stated.  There are just times that discretion is warranted.  After all, remember the BSA motto.

        • NelsonM77

          @justis 1 You continue to make the assertion that all homosexuals are pedophiles. They are not. In fact, many child molesters are heterosexual. Child abuse of this type isn’t about sexual attraction. Straight men molest children of both sexes. The problem here isn’t that I’m misunderstanding something, you are misunderstanding quite a bit my friend.

      • FrankOrlandoWilson

        @NelsonM77

  • Rick

    Hey folks. Just received an e-mail from UPS.
     
    “The UPS Foundation believes its funding must align with UPS’s non-discrimination policies.. UPS did not pull funding or take action that directly targets the Boy Scouts of America. UPS did deploy a policy for new grant requests that is applicable to all prospective grantees.”
     
    Well, UPS, realign this a-holes. This was part of a response after we cancelled our corporate account.
    Arrogant SOBs, Go, along with the queer agenda or get your funding cut off because it doesn’t align with thier non-discrimination policies.
     
    Come on folks before it’s too late. Tell your family and friends to stop supporting this nonsense. Apparently it’s just fine to discriminate against those people and organizations of faith!
     
    DOWN WITH UPS. Let’s get them where it hurts! Their pocketbook!

    • NelsonM77

      Hopefully your friends and family are not hate filled bigots. Hopefully, they can see that UPS is doing the right thing by urging the Boy Scouts of America to abandon their discriminatory practices.  Faith is the least valuable way to make determinations about the world. Believing something without evidence is intellectual treason. To abandon all reason for blind allegiance to superstition is utterly and completely nonsensical. While it is not socially acceptable to discriminate against people of faith, it should become practice that their beliefs be questioned at every possible opportunity. If your beliefs cannot stand up to critical inquiry, they have no place in public discourse.

      • Rick

        @NelsonM77 The Courts have upheld BSA position. UPS is not doing the right thing. The BSA does not discriminate, never has. Disagreeing with social and biblical beliefs which do not embrace homosexuality does not make them hate filled bigots. Want to see hate filled bigots? Just look at the majority of queer organizations and their bigotry and hatefulness against humanity!

        • NelsonM77

          Does the BSA discriminate against homosexuals? YESDoes this make them bigots? YESDoes it matter that an old book says it’s not right to be gay? NO
          Does the court’s decision support an organization’s wish to discriminate provide justification for such discrimination? NO

        • vandalii

          @NelsonM77 The word “discriminate” is another of the words the left has hijacked in the last few decades.  Once upon a time, discrimination was what was done to determine the relative value of one thing or another.  Does anyone remember the phrase, “discriminating taste” which indicated a person of class?  Yes, homosexuality is discriminated away from the BSA for the same reason that pedophiles are discriminated against — the BSA understands the use of recruitment in the homosexual (and pedophile) ranks and does not want the BSA to become a new recruiting station.   Since homosexuals are unable to actually bear children within their homosexuality they must “propagate” via recruitment.  BSA says, “not here!” as a matter of “discriminating taste”.
           
          Some day we will find out that “right” and “wrong” aren’t legislated values but intrinsic values.  Until then, I’m afraid NelsonM77 will continue to believe that somehow a consensus decision can determine what is right and what is wrong.  Ah well, the blind are always with us :-(.

        • NelsonM77

          @vandalii  Right and wrong are subjective to the society we live in. It is up to us to decide what type of society we wish to live in. As god is made up by man, so are god’s laws. They are simply those things our ancient ancestors didn’t want questioned. That’s why men said god did it. To keep the sheeple in line.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 VAndalii surely has it right and Nelson has it all wrong. Wise parents of young boys will do well to support the Boy Scout organization and encourage activities which help build strong bodies and clear-thinking adults. That’s the aim of the BSA. For some reason that’s opposed by UPS. And NelsonM77.

      • vandalii

        @NelsonM77 Ah, there it is.  “Hate” “bigot” — memes of the left.  Troll away, NelsonM77.  You’ve outted yourself with your choice of epithets, though you missed the opportunity to use “racist” ;-).

        • NelsonM77

          @vandalii Do you even know what an Internet Troll is? Have you any idea?  I doubt it because you also seem to forget that almost every single gay person on the planet, was born of straight parents. The gays don’t need to procreate, the rest of us do it for them. PEOPLE ARE BORN GAY!!!!

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  It’s absurd to claim that people are born with homosexual tendencies. It’s foolish to claim that queer sex is gay sex. But it’s good when youth are not pushed into sexual practice when they are quite young. Girls are apt to become pregnant. Boys are apt to learn bad sexual practices. But there’s no evidence at all that some males from birth want to have sex only with other males or vice versa for women. No, some people are born to be cheer-leaders who entertain others (gay) and others are not extroverts, but none are born to have queer sex but most can be taught to be homosexual when marriage is long delayed as has become the general practice in the U.S.A.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen Wow, do you really think that straight guys can be talked into being gay? Sir, you beat all I’ve ever seen. LOL. Personally, I’m not that easy. I find it hard to imagine many men would be.

      • Ray Downen

        @NelsonM77 How unwise you are to accuse the Boy Scouts of America of discriminating in any unnecessary way. Their organization would fall apart if parents found that the scoutmasters were not heterosexual, for normal parents want their sons to grow up to be family men so the parents can be grandparents. Good for the parents! Good for their sons, and the scoutmasters approved by the organization. They deserve our thanks and support. And FedEx and USPS handle packages very well, thank you.

  • Rick

    Hey folks, this board is being inundated with TROLLS!
     
    Please, do not feed the trolls!
     
    What does this have to do with UPS dissing the BSA and cutting of their funding because they refuse to go along to get along with Queer Nation?

    • NelsonM77

      It is important to bring up the religious nature of these discriminatory practices because the foundation for the discrimination is unsound. It is a good thing that UPS has done and it must be pointed out that the Boy Scouts of America is in the wrong.

      • iho

        @NelsonM77
        You complain about religion, and then pretend to be God. Your claim that “the Boy Scouts of America is in the wrong” is based entirely on your confidence that you are infallible.

        • NelsonM77

          @iho Wrong iho,
           My assertion that the BSA is wrong is based on the fact that they discriminate in their hiring practices and in who they allow to be members of their group. And they are not even ashamed of it. They should be. And they should be called out on it, because believing that gays are evil because some book says so is just plain stupid. No, I don’t pretend to be anyone’s imaginary friend.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  It’s not “some book” that says abnormal sex is wrong. It’s common sense and also preservation of mankind. Queers don’t produce children and this nation needs future taxpayers. So to encourage abnormal sex is not sensible in ANY way. The organization has it right as they have since the organization was first founded. Scouts have been helped to grow up to be good citizens and good men. That’s always the aim. 
           
          It’s men who like being men who love women who help boys grow up to be good men. The last thing most parents would want is a scoutmaster who is going to encourage or teach their son to be queer. What is needed is one who likes to camp out and has patience to enjoy teaching others how to build a campfire, erect a tent, cut down a tree for firewood and the like. And to fish and enjoy it. And to hunt. And to be a patriotic citizen of this republic. These are all goals of the Boy Scout organization and very good goals they are.

        • Dodie1990

          @Ray Downen @NelsonM77 You think that all the unlimited population growth you desire will be taxpayers? It is now certain that 47% are not. With no jobs except Wal-Mart and other part-time minimum wage ones, your unlimited population growth will be on welfare and run up the costs for gasoline food and housing as we are overrun with more people. While you can be against same sex marriages, having a bunch of welfare kids is not the reason to marry. Most kids now to unmarried women anyway. With 8% unemployment what work you think they will do?

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen Wow, ignorance as vast as yours always seems to amaze me. You cling to a false idea that gay men are out to convert your sons into a gay lifestyle. You seem to operate under the idea that all gay men want you and every other man on Earth to be gay. Why do you think this? Have you been inundated with gay sex invitations? Been asked to declare yourself “fabulous”? Come on, man, if the picture in your avatar is of yourself, you appear to be a seasoned adult. Grow up, and get over yourself. Homosexuals simply want to be allowed to live their lives. It doesn’t matter that people like you have preconceived notions that they are unwilling to adjust. Sex is not always about procreation. We humans can, just about, grow new humans from skin cells. Notice I did say “just about”. We have some hurdles to leap over first. But my point is, that sex for the sole purpose of procreation, is a thing of the past. You might be interested to know that people do it for recreation as well. Generally, procreation is an afterthought.
          The last I checked, the Boy Scouts aren’t concerned with procreation. Also, the last I checked, men didn’t have to be attracted to women to build a campfire, fish, hunt, chop wood, etc.

        • Ray Downen

          @Dodie1990  It’s not necessary for anyone to grow up lawless and anti-social. Every child has opportunities to learn to do well. The Boy Scout organization is one which helps young men mature into good citizens and good neighbors and good husbands and fathers. They couldn’t do it without scoutmasters whose aims are to do just that.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 I note that you think since we have differing viewpoints that I must be vastly ignorant, clinging to wrong ideas. And indeed I must admit that there is much I don’t know that it would be good if I did know. But I know without possibility of being wrong that there is a God who cares how I think and speak and act, and that God wants me to live well to bring credit to Him and His Son Jesus. Of course you are right that any person, male or female, can build a campfire, fish, hunt, chop wood, etc. And not every homosexual is intent on “hitting on” every person of the preferred sex that they meet. I’m sorry if I seemed to imply that. I’m sure that the policy of the Boy Scouts of America is the right policy concerning the sexual leanings of men who volunteer to lead scout troups. It’s best if they are married and love a wife. Examples are helpful.

        • Ray Downen

          @Dodie1990  A civilization is dying unless the birth rate is over 2 per family unit. And the best family unit is a man and his wife. So that’s what is recommended. We never know what a child will do with his/her life. We hope for the best. We seek good schools and good neighborhoods and good churches with a desire for encouraging children to do well for themselves and for society. We should also encourage immigration for the same reasons. Those who want to come here and be good citizens should be allowed to do so. And helped to do so. .

      • minime91746

        @NelsonM77 Nonsense

      • Ray Downen

        @NelsonM77 What? You’ve got it exactly wrong. Boys should grow up to be men, and that’s what the Boy Scout organization aims to help happen. Abnormal sex is not normal sex. What UPS has done is the opposite of what they should be doing. What the Boy Scout organization is doing is exactly right, helping boys grow up as normal men rather than queers. Camping out. Hunting. Outdoor activities are especially valuable for city boys, but are good for all and to have a man who is good with outdoor activities as a leader for the boys is good all the way.

      • Ray Downen

        @NelsonM77 I received yesterday a book sent to me for proofing by my printer in an eastern state. He sent it by UPS and it got here just fine. I’ll ask him to not use UPS next time, but he’ll do what he thinks is best, and we’ll neither one complain. I observe that the Boy Scout organization is worldwide and so far as I know always seeks to choose men of good repute to serve as unpaid scoutmasters. Of course they do not place in leadership men thought to have unusual sexual appetites. They are wise and would be most unwise to let strange folks become teacher/leaders of boys we hope will become leaders in our nations in years to come. I’m glad Nelson isn’t picking our scoutmasters.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen   I’m sure that the Boy Scouts of America have the absolute best intentions in mind when choosing the Scoutmasters for there organization, however, there is no reason to think that a Gay man poses any more of a threat than a straight one. Straight men molest boys, too. The boxes that you like to organize the world into are not working. People don’t fit into nice neat little packages, they’re complex, sweet, disgusting, beautiful, and ugly all at the same time. Stereotyping people into little boxes doesn’t work because they end up spilling out and getting into other boxes, usually with one arm in one and a leg or two in another. Some of my friends think I am wasting my time. I like to think that by engaging those who think differently than I, that I could very well be planting a seed that will grow in the minds of anyone who reads my words. I rarely believe that I will change anyone’s mind. It is up to the individual to do that for themselves. The data is available for all to see. If someone refuses to accept it, there’s not a thing in the world I can do to change that. They have to make that choice to remain in ignorance, or open their eyes and see the majesty of reality.

  • justis 1

    To NelsonM77.   I also have a difficulty accepting the fact that thousands of grown men fly to Asia to have forced sex with 8-12 year old young boys and girls every year.  This is the most disgusting type of behavior imaginable.  Does this make me a bigot in your world or where do you draw the line.   It’s alright for you to call all of us bigoted when we do not agree with you, but you, on the other hand, think that if you scream loud enough, we will just pack our bags and go home.  Sorry, but we will not back down, we are entitled to our opinions just as you are.  Don’t start calling people names and not expect to get called out for it.

    • NelsonM77

      @justis 1 Exactly what does any of this^ have to do with homosexuals? Nothing. What you apparently have a problem with is pedophilia. I’m with you. I do not think grownups should be having sex with children. Children are not developed enough to make those types of decisions, and adults are more capable of coercing children. That is why pedophilia is not allowed. Homosexuals on the other hand have the full consent of their adult partners. I have no problem with that. Aren’t you glad we’ve cleared that up.

      • vandalii

        @NelsonM77  @justis 1 Umm, you might want to check your facts a bit.  I know of a number of my son’s friends who recently came “out” and have partners 20-30 years older than them.  And yes, they are minors.  Homosexuality has no age limits.  I’m glad we cleared *that* up.

        • NelsonM77

          @vandalii  @justis 1 Ok little Johnny, lets have a lesson. All spoons are utensils, but NOT all utensils are spoons. All dishwashers are appliances, but NOT all appliances are dishwashers. Do you see a trend? Some sexual predators are gay, but NOT all gays are sexual predators. Are we clear now? You keep making the false assumption that someone being gay makes them want to rape kids. I really hope you get it this time.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77  You seem to want to justify homosexual behavior. I have no right to judge you, but I’d think it would be wise if you are homosexual for you to not brag about it. It’s abnormal rather than normal. It’s different from what God intends normal people to be, so far as I know. There’s good reasons for us to try to please God and honor Him and cause others also to love and serve Him. I hope that’s your objective.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen No Ray, I’m a woman loving red-blooded heterosexual man. However, that doesn’t stop me from advocating for human rights. I doubt you will see it this way as you have already stated a belief in a deity as your reason to deny rights to gay people. I do not believe in any deity.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 Of course I believe in God. How anyone could see this universe in which we dwell and believe it all just happened to happen is not easy to understand. DNA had to be thought of before it happened. And the thinker had to be able to create, as God surely was and is. It might not seem obvious right away, but the designer didn’t make all humans male as He surely would have it homosexuality had been his plan. God made woman for man. Sexual desire is built into each human. By God’s design, I’m sure. God gives rights to all. But He calls for those who give in to homosexual lusts to be killed rather than honored. I’m sorry for anyone who imagines there is no God.

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen It looks like all we can agree on is how pitiful we both are, for I pity you as well. You are not paying attention to what the world is finding out while you keep your mind closed. We are uncovering the secrets of life on a daily basis. We have found the the beginnings of life orbiting young stars. The building blocks for amino acids, needed to make protein, has been found floating around the gas and dust cloud of a new star 375 light years from Earth. Included in this list of life building essentials is adenine which is one of the four chemical bases of DNA and RNA. Other parts such as ribose can be found as well. We’ve also found simple sugar molecules such as glycolaldehyde. While you sit there wondering how someone can see this Universe taking shape without a creator, some very sharp minds are out there observing it to find out the truth. No, DNA didn’t have to be “thought of”. It simply needed the precursors, which were made from the elements by completely natural processes.It is always interesting to me that the religious try and use this argument of “complexity needing a creator”. Any deity capable of “designing” our Universe would be vastly more complex and would necessitate a much more complex creator, ad infinitum. No, a designer is not necessary, at all.Also, anyone calling for the death of someone, simply for finding love from someone of the same sex, should be imprisoned for terroristic threats. Anyone who would hold such a being as a moral guide, are just as twisted and in need of psychological help. The god of the bible was a barbarian, created by barbarians, to control barbarians. We have outgrown this immature behavior and learned to settle our differences through discussion and understanding. Why can’t your god?

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 Some people are scholars. Some are slow learners. We’re not all exactly alike. But those who imagine that finding traces of building blocks in existence and positing from finding those blocks that somehow those blocks decided to get together and create a living creature is amazing. It’s never happened, but they think it could happen so they imagine that it must have happened. These dreamers are not scholars. Many of us like facts rather than guesses. All evolution theorists can come up with is guesses. How strange that they claim to have superior intelligence! God has revealed Himself in the Bible through many different writers over a long span of years. We now know Him well. He MADE things. NEW things. Previously unknown things. And here are people so unwise as to think they are as wise as the immortal God!

        • 2chestnuts

          @NelsonM77 @Ray Downen What?

        • NelsonM77

          @Ray Downen And here we have someone so unwise as to think ancient goat herders knew everything about the world around them. Here, we have someone so unwise as to think that a book written, rewritten, translated, and copied, is the accurate and infallible word of an all powerful deity, who chose in his infinite wisdom to reveal his ultimate truth to the world by inspiring illiterate people into believing that they have a magical friend watching over them. How can you really place more value on superstition, irrationality, and blind adherence to meaningless dogma, over meticulous observation of the natural world and the application of critical review and logic? I have few words to describe how completely intellectually bankrupt your position becomes when you abandon reason for faith. You say you want facts, well, where are the facts behind your religion? You don’t have any. All you have is hearsay. What makes it worse is that the hearsay is thousands of years old and it was hearsay about a story that none of the witnesses witnessed themselves.                                                                                                     Evolution is a scientific theory that has stood up to scrutiny for over 150 years. People have tried in vain to lash out at it as some kind of boogie man. The most hilarious part of this is that all evolution does, is describe what nature is doing, that’s it. The fact that it is not what your religion taught you is of no consequence. Nature will not be stopped. It cannot. Evolution marches on with or without your express permission. You may not agree with what is happening, but your participation is mandatory. Human Beings are not the great experiment of some grand wizard in the sky. We are simply another step along the road of ever changing biological diversity. There is no end result, and we therefore cannot be the crowning achievement in a show that is not over.       I know it makes people feel great to think of themselves as special, unfortunately, we are not. Our egos have to be put in check. We are simply animals with an advanced capacity for reason and logic, and also an instinctual skill for spotting patterns. It is this last part that keeps us mired in superstitious nonsense, as we struggle to define the meaning behind the patterns we are so unable to ignore. It’s easy to slip into  complacency and accept what we’ve always been told, instead of challenge old ideas and find out whether the patterns are coincidence or causation.

        • Ray Downen

          @NelsonM77 Evolution theories have no basis in fact, and no proof yoet pointing to how any species of life became a different specie. It’s all based on guesswork with absolutely no facts to stand on. The Bible has not been rewritten many times as is asserted. Translations have been made, with some translators feeling free to reword texts, but the original texts still stand. 
           
          People were people in Bible times (spanning well over 1,000 years) and people are still people nearly 2,000 years after the last Bible book was penned. The stories told by the Master Storyteller still strike chords of recognition in human hearts.There’s every reason to believe that the Bible is a word from God. Human religions may be based on superstition. The Bible is based on facts. Evolutionary theories have no basis in facts. God calls for humans to live unselfishly. Homosexuality is based on selfishness and is never recommended as being Godly.

        • Ray Downen

          Evolutionary theories have no basis in fact, and no proof yet pointing to how any species of life became a different specie. It’s all based on guesswork with absolutely no facts to stand on. The Bible has not been rewritten many times as is asserted. Translations have been made, with some translators feeling free to reword texts, but the original texts still stand. 
           
          People were people in Bible times (spanning well over 1,000 years) and people are still people nearly 2,000 years after the last Bible book was penned. The stories told by the Master Storyteller still strike chords of recognition in human hearts.There’s every reason to believe that the Bible is a word from God. Human religions may be based on superstition. The Bible is based on facts. Evolutionary theories have no basis in facts. God calls for humans to live unselfishly. Homosexuality is based on selfishness and is never recommended as being Godly.

        • Ray Downen

          Evolutionary theories have no basis in fact, and no proof yet pointing to how any species of life became a different specie. It’s all based on guesswork with absolutely no facts to stand on. The Bible has not been rewritten many times as is asserted. Translations have been made, with some translators feeling free to reword texts, but the original texts still stand. 
           
          People were people in Bible times (spanning well over 1,000 years) and people are still people nearly 2,000 years after the last Bible book was penned. The stories told by the Master Storyteller still strike chords of recognition in human hearts.There’s every reason to believe that the Bible is a word from God. Human religions may be based on superstition. The Bible is based on facts. Evolutionary theories have no basis in facts. God calls for humans to live unselfishly. Homosexuality is based on selfishness and is never recommended as being Godly.

      • 2chestnuts

        @NelsonM77 @justis 1

      • 2chestnuts

        @NelsonM77 @justis 1 The latest study shows that children with parents of the same sex, are sexually abused 4 times more frequent by one parent or the other then children in homes with a Mom and Dad.

        • NelsonM77

          @2chestnuts  @NelsonM77  @justis Please give us a link to the study in question. I found one sturdy that, on the surface, seems to show that children of same-sex parents don’t fare as well, but once the methodology is evaluated, the study only shows that children from unstable homes tend not to do as well. I haven’t seen any studies showing a correlation to sex abuse.,

  • Mitch A

    I will be paying close attention and refusing to use UPS services whenever possible.

  • justis 1

    will never use UPS again and will urge other friends to use Fed Ex instead.  this will cost them approx. $20K annually.  last word on this subject.  moving on.

  • 2chestnuts

    Anyone closely associated with Boy Scouts of America should protest the decision by UPS.
    The Boy Scout Assoc. has been a positive enforcement of American values and it should NEVER be undermined by those that oppose our rights and freedoms. UPS has no right to eliminate support to one of Americas great institutions. This is a sad sign of our times when major, profitable corporations falsely imply that their standards for financial support are impartial when, they indeed, are biased. Fed X here we come!

    • Ray Downen

      @2chestnuts I agree that the Boy Scout organization is great and should be supported by all citizens who want boys to grow up to be good men. And that UPS would withdraw support unless the organization wanted boys to grow up to be perverts is something that they should not be bragging about and that should cause anyone to consider using FedEx instead of UPS for shipping packages.

    • NelsonM77

      @2chestnuts On the contrary, UPS has every right in the world to support or not support anyone they wish. In fact, their new policy is not to support any organization that discriminates on the basis of sexual preference. Hey guess what, that includes the BSA.

      • Ray Downen

        @NelsonM77  Yes, they’re terribly discriminatory. They don’t allow girls to join their organization at all! How dare they?

  • TedSmith3

    This simplifies things for me.  I now only have to choose between FedEx and USPS.

  • JimSchafer

    i  disagree with UPS. the BSA should not have to align itself with any organization that does not parallel itself to the existing by-laws. the gay/lesbian lifestyle is an “alternative” lifestyle, and co-incides with the definition of “abnormal” or “unusual”. thus by their own statements, they realize that they have no place in a normal society. they, themselves, have identified themselves as non-social(and not anti-social). they have placed themselves outside the realm of society.  therefore they have no means nor rights to make ANY comlaint of other organizations that are already in existence that do not agree with their “alternative” lifestyle. In otherwords the BSA are in my eyes-that are wide open- have an excellent record and should be tampered with.
    howeverr there are alternative postal services and there is freedom of alternative postal services. so ups, look out! ! ! there may be  a drop of customers that have provided you with a normal service.